05 Jun 2015 11:19:53
This Rooney Rule is a bit of a talking point?

The Football League for years have been told there is not enough black managers in football. Currently there are 7 out of 72 clubs.

Surely if any candidate was good enough to be a manager of a club then surely race, creed, religion or any other difference us as humans may have would not make a difference.

It doesn't matter what colour of skin we have if you've got the talent then you've got it if not then forget it.

I don't think the rule should be brought in, yes we should encourage more ethnic diversity in management but we do not need to implement rules to enforce it.

What's everyone else's thoughts?

{Ed007's Note - With things like that I always think it's just as wrong getting a job because of your skin colour or religion as not getting it. A better candidate not getting a job just because there is a target or quota to meet is wrong.
In the legal profession there is a Black Lawyers Association, can you imagine the uproar if someone popped up with a White Protestant Lawyers Association?
The question is why is one set of people allowed to discriminate against another yet other groups doing the exact same get pilloried, there was talk of starting a Black Footballers Association, - isn't that racist against white people though?

1.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 12:37:51
Yeah ed I totally agree jobs of any nature should be given through merit.

To have racial groups more or less discriminate against themselves; don't know if discriminate is the right choice of word there but hopefully you grasp what I am trying to get at, is hypocritical I think. It more or less means you are asking to be the token minority.

Don't think I could take a job under those circumstances as I would always have the uneasy feeling that it was not through the correct circumstances and could you really feel comfortable if you knew you were not up to the task.

{Ed007's Note - I know exactly what you mean but I can't think of the right word for it either lol.}

2.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 12:54:58
I struggle to think of any black manager that has done a good job in English or Scottish
Barnes gullitt ince didn't do that well and they are probably the highest profile
Surely if directors pay black players 100k a week then they would be willing to employ a black manager
And personally I don't see guys like Ian Wright Dwight Yorke andy Cole going for managers jobs
Rio could be a good manager but time will tell and he may not come back to the game

{Ed007's Note - John Barnes is a classic example of using his colour to cover his failings, it's nothing to do with his skin colour, it's to do with the fact he's a $hit manager/coach. Paul Ince is the same except he has an ego to rival Mourinho.}

3.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 13:16:57
Im not racist, have a lot of friends from all walks of life. Does my head in when you hear this colour card being played time and time again.

Its just crap managers who have done nothing in football and can't get a job like John Barnes and Paul Ince causing trouble.

4.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 14:43:52
It's called positive discrimination and happens all over the world where organisations try and employ people of a certain race relegion gender or ethnicity. For example The Met police did it as did the new Irish police force where they were forcing through black and catholics into their relevant forces no matter how competent or not they were. This was to the detriment of other candidates who did not meet their set requirements. It's wrong but they get away with it by putting a positive spin on it that it reflects the communities or environment they are working in. Hence positive discrimination.

{Ed007's Note - (yes)

5.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 15:25:39
"The question is why is one set of people allowed to discriminate against another yet other groups doing the exact same get pilloried, there was talk of starting a Black Footballers Association, - isn't that racist against white people though?"

The reason there is positive discrimination in western societies is because for hundreds of years these minorities have been discriminated against. in the context of this issue, black people.

these differences in attitudes towards certain races permeates through to all walks of life. not just open carry in the USA. My father can tell me of instances in his younger days when he, and thousands like him, were denied jobs in Glasgow because they were Catholic.

In the same way that 'Orangefest' et al should be stopped, similar initiatives are required to battle, and it is a battle, discrimination in all its forms. These initiatives aren't perfect but they need to be tried, tested and adjusted accordingly to try and tackle the problem.

{Ed007's Note - For me there can never be anything positive about any discrimination. There was also places in Glasgow that didn't employ Protestants as well, it just wasn't highlighted as much. Don't you remember the Monklands Scandal and the allegations of sectarianism and nepotism?
So why's it OK for black people to go on about what's happened over the last few hundred years yet it's not OK for the OO to do it? Is it because you don't agree with them?
Shouldn't everybody move on, it's 2015 after all?}

6.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 16:15:41
because its black people,not white people, who were subjected to hundreds of years of slavery and subsequent racist abuse/attacks. Even today, the riots in the USA. it ain't white suburbs getting heavy handed police treatment. black people get shot dead by the police daily in the US. not white people. Black people in the USA and in the UK are the minority. Protestants aren't a minority in Scotland. In the 50's in Glasgow, protestants weren't denied jobs because they were Protestants. The Orange Order are not a minority being discriminated against.They are the discriminators. that's the difference.

{Ed007's Note - So it's all just the usual pointless fickleness then and it depends who you ask what answer you get. I'm surprised we don't see more and more people walking around CP bent double with the amount of self righteous causes they seem to attach themselves to.
Is it only minorities that are allowed to go on about the past then?}

7.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 16:16:49
and positive discrimination is a poorly thought up name. its more like social inclusion.

{Ed007's Note - How can the National Black Police Association be about social inclusion when you need to be black to be in it? I could be the best D.I. in the country and not be allowed to join the NBPA simply because of the colour of my skin. For a start that's excluding the majority of the population and sounds more like a secret society or a cult, just like Masons or the OO who I wouldn't be allowed to join because of my religion. Why is one acceptable and one isn't?}

8.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 16:27:13
This whole thing infuriates me. And it'll just open a can of worms I don't really have the energy to dig into. Positive discrimination, enforced 'equality' and promoted diversity. Just all grinds on me and the PC brigade are nothing but hypocritical if anything. Its a bit off but still a quite relevant but funny story. At uni some daft lassies organised a 'sexual equality fayre'. No word of a lie, it was £2 for men and £1.50 for ladies!!

{Ed007's Note - Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a piece of $hit by the clean end.}

9.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 17:30:47
Beautifully worded Ed. Think it might be my first tattoo.

10.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 17:45:21
If where we live was totally PC then the Tories wouldn't of won the general election.

Fact is they won as there are a lot of folk agree with austerity measures and think there should be a cap on the amount of benefit folk can receive. They also don't think folk that are well off (excluding your Royal family etc) and have worked hard all their days shouldn't be penalised with higher tax rates - not a popular view but there you go.

Some of the softer measures where you do keep throwing money at a problem can potentially bankrupt the Country.

I had a discussion recently about woman/men not that long ago and it did get a bit heated. Nicola Sturgeon and Margaret Thatcher were used as great female role models - eh, no ta

11.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 17:48:37
Well the Orange walks are all about a majority banging on about the past,so, no it's not limited exclusively to minorities. The majority of police officers in the UK are white and therefore already included. They have no need for initiatives to create a greater ethnically white police force. Do you think Palestinians should stop there whining about decisions taken decades ago? Just accept the status quo even if it is unjust?Should the 10% or so Christians in Egypt continue to be persecuted and just silently take it? Minorities,by there very nature of being in a minority need support. whatever the cause. Maybe Scots, whether Catholic or Protestant, should accept the UK Tory government without complaint because we only make up approximately 10% of the UK population. Never mind the injustices of their policies.
Edward71

{Ed007's Note - Ooofftt we're over in Palestine now! Do you think Israel and Jews should stop going on about the Holocaust? Are the Jews a minority allowed to bring up the past or a majority that should keep their mouth shut because of what's going on over there today?
Or like everything else it depends what suits on any given day and whether YOU agree with the minority or majority?}

12.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 18:11:01
Rapidly promoted by an unscrupulous media!😂 yeah the MSM in Scotland especially the sports pages are regularly decried on this site as an extension of the 'we are the majority, Peepel!' How do you fight a sectarian organisation that, is in the majority in Scotland, is overtly prejudice towards a specific minority group, and has it's hooks into every institution with any power, judicial or otherwise? Judges,police force, councils etc? Just stop bleeting about it? Just try your best in a loaded game?

{Ed007's Note - I didn't mention the Scottish media did I? The thread actually started about something in England and you brought up the US.
Is it only minorities you're sympathetic towards that are allowed to dwell on the past? Do you think it's OK for a Catholic to discriminate against a Protestant in Scotland but not in Italy or Ireland where Protestants are the minority?
Would you be in favour of an OO parade passing the Vatican? I'm sure you won't mind me paraphrasing:

'How do you fight a sectarian organisation that, is in the majority in Italy, is overtly prejudice towards a specific minority group, and has it's hooks into every institution with any power, judicial or otherwise? Judges,police force, councils etc? Just stop bleeting about it? Just try your best in a loaded game?'

13.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 18:11:37
just to lighten the mood a little guys. heard that the Irish FA tried to implement the "Rooney Rule" last season but they could not find enough coaches/managers called Rooney lol

14.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 18:33:42
John Barnes went over the top , he said something that he got sacked at Celtic because he was Black. Surely if Celtic had researched sufficiently they would have known the colour of his skin before they hired them.

15.) 05 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 18:39:53
That doesn't make much sense. When the Jews were persecuted during the Second World War they were a minority. Their subsequent persecution of Palestinians finds them in the majority. It's a great example of how a people can be both the victim and the perpetrator. What defines their differing roles in each situation? Minority and majority respectively. Minorities get persecuted; majorities don't. Generally speaking. I hope that answer is clear. Not just an answer a question with a question. But having answers your question I would like to propose a question in which I would really appreciate an answer if it's not to much trouble;o)
Would you support an initiative to redress the balance of Ibroke season ticket holding orange ludge attending referees in the Scottish National Assembly of referees association or whatever it's called, or, just stop whining about all those honest mistakes and accept the way things are? "Yeah it's corrupt but it's been corrupt for ages so stop going on about it, try your best as a non ludge going practicing catholic celtic season ticket holder to get a job as one of Scotland's elite referees,eh?" Help for minorities are usually borne out of a need for it. If 90% of the UK police force was black, white and black people would be creating a national white police association for white only officers and rightly so. So, for or against a redress of Scottish referees?
Edward71

{Ed007's Note - Ah right... got you now, and exactly what I expected.}

16.) 06 Jun 2015
05 Jun 2015 23:50:58
Timalloy I suppose you know why Irish jokes are stupid , so that Scottish people can understand them.

17.) 06 Jun 2015
06 Jun 2015 00:01:40
Mrs E , winning the election doesn't necessary show a lot . The Tory only got somewhere in the mid thirties as a percentage of the vote . Successive politicians especially in the UK have over the decades turned so many people off voting , that the biggest block of voters are those who don't vote .
Also 50% of Scottish people voted in 56/57 SNP. MPs in Scotland , hardly a fair representation of the voters wishes .

18.) 06 Jun 2015
06 Jun 2015 06:57:29
Ah, still nothing from ed007. bottled it! Didn't like the fact that the answers you were given made sense to you. So you just sacked it. Absolute disgrace

19.) 06 Jun 2015
06 Jun 2015 07:06:17
50% of Scotland voted for a party with no power to stop the Tories austerity measures so it amounts to the same thing Chris.

They thought they could gamble and get a Labour Govt, why is anyone's guess.

Tim I'm beating you on disagrees 😂😄😜

20.) 06 Jun 2015
06 Jun 2015 08:30:48
@Chris02 reason I can crack an Irish joke is because of my own Irish heritage, the Irish like the Scots can laugh at themselves. @Mrs E you will have to go some to take my "disagreeable title" lol

21.) 06 Jun 2015
06 Jun 2015 09:20:31
You have to log in to disagree - so they must log in, press the button but offer no argument 😄

22.) 06 Jun 2015
06 Jun 2015 17:28:26
Mrs. E the reason I mentioned 50% of the people who voted elected over 90% of the MPs was I was trying to point out that the system of voting in the UK is anti democratic , as it doesn't reflect the wishes of the electorate .

I was very pleased with the result in Scotland, but not happy by the way it came about .

23.) 08 Jun 2015
08 Jun 2015 13:00:27
Got to love a Monday morning trawling through these posts. This one has opened a can of worms. Morgan Freeman answer after being asked how to stop racism was to stop talking about it. No one should be hired for any job based on race, creed or colour. I heard John Barnes say the other week that he has been discriminated against. Nah mate your'e just a sh*t manager. Get over yourself.